Beeson Podcast, Episode 462 Gabby Watts and David Austin September 16, 2019 Announcer: Welcome to the Beeson podcast coming to you from Beeson Divinity School on the campus of Samford University. Now your hosts, Doug Sweeney and Kristen Padilla. Doug Sweeney: Welcome to the Beeson podcast. I'm Doug Sweeney, the Dean of Beeson Divinity School and I'm here today with my cohost Kristen Padilla. We are brimming with excitement about our interview today with two good friends and colleagues, Gabby Watts and David Austin who attended a life changing conference over the summer. Kristen, would you tell us just a little bit about today's interviewees. Kristen Padilla: Yes. Gabby Watts who if you could see our room is sitting to my left is the program assistant in our Global Center and she's been here now for two years. Is that correct, Gabby or are you going on year three? Gabby Watts: I'm going on year two, so yeah. Kristen Padilla: Year two and she has just made such a wonderful difference in addition to our community here. Gabby is a native of Chicago and she and her husband Andrew are actively involved in missions and she's going to be telling you more about that. Then next to her is a friend of mine as well, Reverend David Austin. He is a master of Divinity student at Beeson and he is also the pastor of Unified Fellowship Community Baptist Church in Midfield. He is married to Katrina and they have one beautiful son David. How old is he now? David Austin: Eight months, yesterday. Kristen Padilla: Eight months. So he is just growing beautifully. I love seeing his pictures, David. So welcome Gabby and David to the Beeson podcast and we just want to begin this conversation with you telling our listeners a little bit about yourself. Who are you? Where did you come from? How did you come to faith in Christ? Why and how did you end up at Beeson? Gabby Watts: Well, thank you for having us. My background is like you stated earlier, I'm from Chicago and I also grew up in church, but I really didn't come to know the Lord until I was in college. It's actually kind of a funny story. I got saved because a cute guy asked me to church my first week of school and he said, "Do you believe in Jesus?" I said, "Of course I believe in Jesus." He said, "You want to come to church with me?" I said, "Yes, I will." I went to church and I got saved. Gabby Watts: So the Lord will use anything. I always tell people that I went to church for a boy, but I left knowing the greatest man I'll ever know. But yeah, me and my husband Andrew, we are very passionate about missions. My background is hospitality and event planning. I worked in Hilton for a couple of years doing that. Gabby Watts: But when I saw this opportunity to marry both of my passions with Beeson, because they were looking for a program assistant who could coordinate things. But I had a passion for missions, and I just couldn't say no to an opportunity like that. So I'm very happy to be here and just to see God move in Beeson. Kristen Padilla: We're glad to have you. David. David Austin: I'm a native Birminghamian. Born and raised here in Birmingham. I'm a preacher's son. My father is a pastor. And because of that, I grew up seeing the mess in the church and didn't want to have anything to do with Christianity, the church, God, I was just... David Austin: After undergrad and a few years in the military. I moved to Atlanta. My aunt lived there and she just kept bugging me about going to church and I was not having it. I was like, "If I don't go, she will just bug me until the end of no time." I went, it was a church plant. They were meeting in the chapel of a funeral home. David Austin: We've heard the story so many times before, it seems like the message God was speaking directly to me. I decided to go back the following Sunday and I gave my life to Christ. I was a smoker at the time, had a brand new pack of Newport's in my pocket. I hadn't even opened. David Austin: The moment that I gave my life to Christ, he took the taste from me. I no longer had a desire to smoke and I walked out of the sanctuary. I pulled the cigarettes out, threw them in the trash, and I've been running for Christ ever since. Doug Sweeney: So Gabby, tell us a story about how you learned of the National African- American Missions Conference and wound up not only going yourself but organizing a group of Beeson people to go. Gabby Watts: Yes. Well, me and my husband, we coordinate kind of like a missions intro and missions mobilization course called prospectus. We were at one of our trainings in Orlando, Florida and one of the representatives came to me and he said, "Hey Gabby, so what do you find is something that I can help you with as you're kind of coordinating these classes and things with what prospectus?" Gabby Watts: I said, "Well maybe you can answer this one question for me. Where are the African-Americans?" He was like, "Whoa." I was like, "I've gone to several of these workshops and I am always the only African-American here." I was like, "I know that they have to be interested. I can't just be the only one." Gabby Watts: He said, "You know what? You need to go to NAAMC." I went, "What's NAAMC?" He said, "It's the National African-Americans Missions Conference. You need to be there. It happens every summer." I went home, I did my research and I told my boss, the director of the Global Center here at Beeson, "Hey we need to go to NAAMC, because it's a conference that is solely geared towards educating and mobilizing African-Americans in missions and helping people to get that information for themselves so they can pass it on to their congregations and organizations." Gabby Watts: Working in the Global Center, which is kind of like the missions hub here at Beeson. I thought this is a no brainer. We have to be there. Just luckily we were able to have the funding that we could send five students. We took three African-American students and two Caucasian students. Some of them were even our mission certificate students. It was an amazing and very impactful time. Kristen Padilla: Explain what a mission certificate is for our listeners. Gabby Watts: Yes. So for students here at Beeson, if you are getting your masters in divinity, you can get a mission certificate. So what that entails is that you will use your elective courses to focus more on missions focused classes. So you would take world religions, you would take an intro to missions course, you would take a course that is revolved around just global Christianity and strategies and things that are playing out. Gabby Watts: You would also do an extended cross-cultural ministry practicum where you would travel overseas for six weeks and learn how to work, and minister, and mentor in a completely different culture of your own under supervision. Kristen Padilla: So David, you have an interesting story. David Austin: Yes. Kristen Padilla: Because when Gabby approached you about going to this conference, you were a bit reluctant. Can you tell us about why that was and how she convinced you to go and what changed? David Austin: Yeah, you used the word reluctance and it's funny because now after telling my conversion story, reluctance may be my middle name. But yeah, I wasn't too fond of missions or the thought of it. Dr. Parks and I had some conversations and from my mindset and from my paradigm, it wasn't something that we did in the black community. In our community. David Austin: When you're from a community that is an oppressed community, you have a tendency to look at the present situation and you can't see beyond that. Or at least I couldn't. I couldn't see beyond what was going on in our communities right then. So the language that I would speak at thousands of miles when there's someone right behind our church that needs our help. I don't have to travel to find people that need help. David Austin: So in the immediate need to me being from a community that needs so much reassuring to me superseded the need of going elsewhere. So when Gabby came to me and asked me and I was like, "Okay. Yeah." I was like, "No. Dr. Parks won't let up." I was like, "Well, school will be letting out. It'll be kind of be cool trip, school is paying for it." Oh, well. David Austin: It was life changing. God did something on that trip with me that I am eternally grateful because as a pastor I was missing it and it's easy to be stifled by pain. My pain was keeping me from being what God has called me to be. So that was the light bulb that got on during the conference for me. It was altering. Life altering. Doug Sweeney: Gabby, I am told that there was one session at the conference in particular that made a big impact on you. Would you tell our audience about that and why it was such a big deal for you? Gabby Watts: Yes. So the very first session that I went to and David actually joined me was called, Where Are All The African-Americans. I gravitated towards that session because that was a question I've been asking for a very long time. It was led by a Dr. Phillip Nelson and he did a phenomenal job of just explaining African-American history in missions. Gabby Watts: I had always heard one name when it came to African-American missions and that was George Liele. That he was a pioneer of missions in the late 1700s and I was like, "Okay. I know him." But that was it. He went through this amazing, beautiful, just breakdown and threw out names I had never heard of like Lott Carey and John Stewart and just kept sharing about how we had this rich history. Gabby Watts: But then through things like slavery and colonization and civil war and the Jim Crow Laws and civil rights issues. How African Americans did an inward turn and he said the problem happened was that they had so many things coming against them. They turned inward and had to basically just focus on self survival. Gabby Watts: So it wasn't in the foreground for them to go out anymore. I was like, "Wow, that's something I had no idea." It wasn't that we just simply lost interest. It was just, there was so many things going on around us that just really hindered and prohibited us from going, and telling, and serving like we should. Gabby Watts: But then the beautiful thing though is that through all of that, he also pointed out how even still God has been faithful. He's been good and that now in our present era, we are seeing a resurgence of African-Americans in missions. It's like we talked about the history, we acknowledge the hindrances, but we're celebrating what God is doing now. I thought that was amazing. Doug Sweeney: That is amazing. I have an advantage on our listeners in that I am looking at you right now and I see that you have an important book with you that I think our listeners might benefit from knowing about. Would you tell them just real briefly what that book is? Gabby Watts: Yes. So this book I've got my hands on has got me really excited. It's called Profiles of African-American Missionaries and it is produced by the William Carey Library. One of the beautiful things that it says on the back of this book is it says, in 2010 the us census Bureau show that there are 42 million people who identify themselves as African-Americans. Of the 42 million, there were only an estimate, 20 million who self identify as Christians. Gabby Watts: Out of this number, very few leave the United States and go to other countries as missionaries. The reason for the absence of African-American missionaries are varied and in some respects understandable. Yet we are all called to be engaged in the great commission and so this book breaks down the history of African-Americans in missions. But also encourages the current generation to I guess to some pick up where these missionaries left off, continue what they were doing because the work is not done yet. Doug Sweeney: That's great. So we will definitely get a copy of that book in our Beeson library and we recommend it highly to our listeners as well. Gabby Watts: Yes. Kristen Padilla: David, let's circle back to you for a minute. You were in that session, you've already shared that this is a life changing experience. This light bulb went off. Can you take us a little bit deeper into that process of what God did through this conference with you and kind of where you are right now, having come back to your congregation as you're thinking about mobilizing your own people for missions? David Austin: Absolutely. That breakout session with Dr. Nelson was just phenomenal. There was something that he said that convicted me to my core, he said, and I wrote it down so I wouldn't mess it up. "The whole church is responsible for taking the whole gospel to the whole world." Doug Sweeney: That's good. David Austin: So it made me realize that through my pain and through my experience here in this wonderful country that we're living in, that I limited myself to my pain or to my community experience and I stopped there. Because I pitied us so much. Where is Christ in that? So where is it that it's written that you shouldn't evangelize if you're experiencing pain? David Austin: So that's where it took me and for me to realize that I had as a pastor at someone that I know that God is call. I was missing it because I wasn't trying to take the whole gospel to the whole world. I was trying to take the portion of the gospel that I related to, to my community and that was life changing. David Austin: So, immediately Gabby and I began to talk and it's almost like we pulled off from everyone else. I was having these ideas running through my head and I was like, "Well, I can do this and I can do that." Because I immediately understood the challenges that I would face trying to get other black pastors in my community to now see it the way that I was seeing it. David Austin: Because they would have arguments in their arguments would be valid from their paradigm. It's hard to get people to look beyond the pain sometimes. I think about... Gabby and I was just just talking about this earlier, about how I had to wrestle with it and I was thinking about how Jacob wrestled with the angel after he wrestled his walk changed. David Austin: After I wrestle, my walk changed. My walk will never be the same again. So, now the question is how do I get others to limp? How do I get them to limp like me and to be able to slow down and see a broader picture and not move in a way that you think is right, but that you know is right. You know, you're being called to. David Austin: So I have some work to do, but it's strategizing. Okay. I told Gabby, I said, "Well, we need to do this. If we can get him to come and speak, and maybe if we did this and I can get five pastors. I need to start with five and I would have to trick them to get them to a meeting." That's where my mind was because it's needed. We are needed on the mission field. I am Christian and God has called me to take His word to those that haven't heard it. Period. Doug Sweeney: Thank you. Kristen Padilla: Go deeper with that, Gabby and David about what African-Americans bring to missions that someone like me, a Caucasian may not be able to. Gabby Watts: I think the African-Americans have very unique role that they play in missions. I really experienced that at the conference, seeing it, but also it made me reflect on things I've experienced personally. I've had the pleasure to travel to a few countries and recently last November, I got to go to India. Gabby Watts: Now my husband is Caucasian and I'm African-American. The experiences that we had were completely different solely because of the color of our skin. We went into very poor and impoverished villages in India and how they responded to my husband and how they responded to me were totally different. Gabby Watts: If my husband Andrew wanted to sit down and talk to them, they would and they would listen, you know? But then if I said something to the women and just because I was an African-American, they felt like they could share their pains and their struggles with me because they know our history and they felt this is more relatable. Gabby Watts: But when they looked at my husband, they just saw a white man where it can definitely just fall back to colonization times. But also just wealth and unrelatable, basically. I think that that is huge and powerful. How just our history, and our legacy, and our culture can just make us more... I don't think inviting is the right word. Gabby Watts: I think it's more so just relatable and they can just understand it. Pain resonates with people. If they feel you can understand their pain then it makes them want to open up and hear more from you and I thought that that was a unique honor that I had as an African-American. Doug Sweeney: David, anything you want to add while we're on this subject? David Austin: No, I mean she hit the nail on the head. It isn't a secret globally what we've suffered as a people here. Doug Sweeney: That's right. David Austin: We can use that to our advantage. And as you were speaking, I was thinking how in certain places here my ethnicity will have doors closed on me. But there in a net aspect doors open for me because they can identify, if nothing else with the pain. So yeah, it just has to be taken advantage of. Doug Sweeney: So Gabby we want to conclude by asking both of you to speak directly to our listeners. Pastors, lay people in churches, Beeson friends, Beeson alums and help them to make good on some of the things you learned this summer at your conference. Doug Sweeney: But before I ask that question, I'm looking at you because I'm also thinking about what difference this conference should make for us at Beeson Divinity School. This year and in the years ahead and surely you've done a little bit of thinking as a Global Center person about what you're hoping Beeson is going to take away and apply based on your experiences in this conference. Gabby Watts: Yes, I did. That conference excited me because for the first time in my life, I learned about our rich history, but I also encountered other African-Americans who are just as passionate about missions as I was. I will never forget the moment at the end of the conference when they said all of the African-Americans that are currently serving as missionaries, please come to the front. Gabby Watts: You just have at least two dozen African-Americans standing right in front of you of various ages. Just standing there proudly saying this is us and we are here and we are on the mission field. It is so powerful to see someone that looks like you doing what you want to do. So, I came back extremely excited and one of my biggest things that I thought that we were missing at Beeson was just a celebration of that. Gabby Watts: We have several missions certificate students, one of them Armstead comes to mind, he's an African-American. In the Global Center we have all these wonderful and beautiful tributes and just information that we give people on missions. But coming back from that conference, I realized, "Hey, we're missing an African-American mission section." Gabby Watts: And things like that where it's a visual representation of our history and our legacy. So that the next Beeson student that comes in here, that says, "I'm thinking about missions, but all I see are bunch of white men on the wall. Maybe this isn't really for me." But then they see a George Liele and realize that African-Americans pioneered missions from the States. Gabby Watts: That's an empowerment that happens and an excitement that happens. That's what I want for the Beeson community. Also, you don't know what you don't know. Information is very powerful. So I would love to just see just that information passed down where we highlight some of these profiles of African-Americans in missions and we talk about them. Gabby Watts: We acknowledged just the history and the hindrances and things that may have calmed it down. And not in a way to point fingers, but just to say, "Hey, this is our history. This is what has happened. But look what God is doing now." Gabby Watts: Two of the Caucasian students that went, they're a married couple. My favorite statement that they said was, they said it was an honor as majority culture to be at this conference because they said they got to sit back for a moment and lament with minority culture on things. Just listen and then celebrate with them. I thought that was so powerful. Doug Sweeney: Now, how about my final question about what our listeners might take away from this, whether they're black or white, no matter what their ethnic background. What should Christians know about what's going on these days among those interested in African-American missions and how might it inspire all of us to be more faithful as gospel witnesses both at home and in other parts of the world? Gabby Watts: I would encourage community, churches, pastors, everyone to really take a look at how they are engaging their community, their churches, and themselves in fulfilling the great commission. I mean it is just so clear in scripture, God's missional heart for his children. It begins in Genesis and it ends in Revelations. Gabby Watts: I think when we take a moment to look inward and assess kind of our heart when it comes towards missions and fulfilling the great commission, then that's the first step. From that overflow we can introduce things like African-Americans in missions and encouraging the minorities in their communities to want to be a part of this. This isn't just a majority culture thing or a white person's thing. Gabby Watts: We all have a part to play in it. We're talking specifically about African-Americans here, but there's a role that Latinos will play in missions. There's a role that the Asian community plays in missions. There's a role that women play in missions that's going to be different than the role that men play in missions. Gabby Watts: Just taking an inward looking and asking really God to use the Holy spirit to reveal to you, how can I take my congregation, or my community, or my family, even myself to the next level and how I think about mission. Doug Sweeney: That's great advice. How about you, David? Anything you want to add to that one? David Austin: Pastorally from the black community. What I would say specifically to those pastors is one of the things that we can't do as pastors is hinder or discourage a person that is being called to something specific. So by ignoring missions. I'm sorry. Ignoring missions, not speaking about missions, not saying how important it is. You can stifle that calling. You can discourage that calling. David Austin: So me personally, I don't want to be the one that hinder someone's calling, because I may not have agreed with the philosophy when the word of God plainly States, go ye therefore. Didn't say go to my little community, 10 streets within 10 blocks. Go ye therefore until the ends of the earth. That's what I would ask for the black pastors in our communities. That's the main take away from me. Don't hinder someone else's calling. Doug Sweeney: You have been listening to Gabby Watts who helps to lead our Global Center here at Beeson Divinity School and pastor David Austin talk about a wonderful conference this summer on African-Americans in missions. Pastor Austin, I wonder if I might ask you to close our time together in a word of prayer. David Austin: Most gracious and eternal father Lord, we thank you right now, father God for what you are doing right now in this time, in this age, and in this era, Lord God. Thank you for using us, father God as a part of your plan and father God, I'm asking that you allow us to have greater influence on those that we need to influence. David Austin: Let us have greater servitude on those that you would have us to serve. Greater love for those that you are calling your own father God. So that your word will be spread to the masses, Lord God. We know that you love us all the same, none higher than the other, and let us begin to love one another the same way. David Austin: Now, father God, I thank you for being in an institution that's willing to talk about difficult and sometimes uncomfortable conversations so that we can grow Lord God in love and in Christian brotherhood and Christian unity. These are many blessings we ask in your son Jesus' name. Amen. Gabby Watts: Amen. Kristen Padilla: Amen. Doug Sweeney: Amen. You have been listening to the Beeson podcast. God bless you. Bye for now. Gabby Watts: If you'd like to learn more information about the National African-American Missions Conference, please visit www.thenaamc.org. That's W-W-W. T-H-E-N-A-A-M-C .O-R-G. Kristen Padilla: You've been listening to the Beeson podcast. The music is provided by the Cathedral Church of the Advent in Birmingham and produced by Zach Hicks. Our engineer is Rob Willis. Our host is Dr. Douglas Sweeney and I'm your co-host Kristen Padilla. We hope you will join us here next week for another episode of the Beeson podcast.